4th April, 2004 sound Sound Cassette English Oral Interview Interview Abhijeet Joshi 147 Vijaylaxmi Dutt Female Dhaka

Glasgow U.K. Graduation EN Hindi, English Okay, like I just mentioned, I would just like to start of with just a little bit of your backgrounds, where you are from? My original family came from Bangladesh. Okay. But after the partition we moved to the Delhi To Delhi. I was brought up in Delhi. Were you born in Bangladesh? Yes. Okay. In Dhaka. In Dhaka, and is that where your parents are both from in Dhaka as well. No, my mother was from Dhaka and my, my father was from Mymensingh. Okay. It's another district. Another District. Not in Dhaka. In that area. In near about. Okay. So how old were you then when you moved to Delhi? I was about 5 or 6. So you don't remember so much? No, not from Dhaka. Okay. And what was your father's profession? My father's profession was accountant. Okay. He was, when I was born he was a bank manager. In? In Bangladesh. In Bangladesh. Okay. And, so when he moved to Delhi, then he became? He, he didn't do managing any more but he did, he worked in Common Wealth War Graves Commission. Okay. Have you heard about it? I've heard, yeah, yeah. They've got head office in this in Maidenhead. Yeah. And he works, he worked? No he didn't work there. In Delhi he worked with them. In Delhi he worked for them, yeah, yeah. Okay. And did your mother work or is she a housewife? No, she never worked. Okay. Did you have brothers and sisters? Yes, I have two sisters and a brother. Okay, and were you the eldest or youngest? I am the eldest. The eldest, so you had to look after. Okay, can you tell me a little bit about your life in Delhi, your growing up? What was it like? Were you? It was good. Yeah. Happy life Yeah. Happy. Most of it happy. I can only remember, I think it was happy at the beginning when we came from, you know, settling down, it was difficult then but, not for me, I think for my mother. It was quite hard work. Did she talk to you much about that or, or? She did yes. Yeah. Yes, because Delhi was then, we used to have very bad winter and we came from quite a warm place and, and it was really completely different. She has to fetch water from outside to inside and it was hard work. It was difficult for her. Okay, and did you go to school then, yeah? Yes. What was that? What kind of school did you go to? It was a good school, it was a mixed. Yeah, was it a mixed or? No. No. Only girls. All girls. All girls but later on we moved to another place then it was co-educational. Okay. Those are also in Delhi area or? Delhi. Okay, right. And how far then did you go with your education? I was a teacher. You were a teacher, so I am an economics teacher. Okay. I was teaching in a school and then my husband went from here, and we met and we got married. So he was here already, your husband, or he came? He came to Delhi. Oh, okay. So was that an arranged, arranged marriage or? You could say arranged or, you know, I was grown up also and I had the say whether I want to get married or not. Yeah. They didn't force me. Yeah, but it was kind of between the families? Arranged, yes. Okay. So did you get married in Delhi. What was? No. No? Married in Agra. In where? In Agra. Agra. Agra. How come you got married there, is that where his family are from? His, his father was at that time living in Agra and he was over eighty. So he couldn't move to Delhi, you know it was difficult for him, so instead we moved there and got married there. Okay. So what was your wedding like? Can you tell me a little bit about it? It was Hindu marriage. Yeah. Was it a big, big one or? Quite a big, not too big or, Okay. And what was your? Hurriedly arranged. Hurriedly arranged, okay. And your husband's profession then, what, what did he do? He was a, a general practitioner, but at that time he was working in hospital. Okay. So he had some leave and then. Was he studying then or work, he was working? No, he was working. Okay. So did you go back to England straight away or to? Did you go to Scotland or England? No I came England. England. My husband was working in King Edward the VII Hospital in Windsor. He was working there so I came. I came, but I didn't live in London, just outside a place called Ivorheath. Oh yes, okay. It's a nice village. Yeah. Small village. I lived there first Okay. For first one and a half years. Okay. Then we moved to Scotland in Edinborough. Yeah. Then Glasgow. Then Glasgow. So did you come together then, after you got married, did you find him or? Then I came a year later. A year later! How come? I was supposed to come within two months because of, my, I didn't have passport or anything to arrange of this. Time. Time, but what happened is my father-in-law was very ill, he was bed ridden so I had to stay back and my husband came after three days and by the time I came it was a year. Oh wow. So you stayed with your in- laws for that whole period in time or? In-laws yes. Yeah, in Agra, in Agra. No, in Delhi. He In Delhi. He was brought back from Okay. Agra to Delhi for better medical facilities. Okay. And my sister-in-law was in Delhi in university, in Delhi University so just after marriage I stayed in Delhi University. Stayed there. Okay. So, when you came to England for the first time yourself, did you fly over on your own? Yes. Was that your first time leaving? Can you tell me a little bit about what you were thinking and feeling about at, at that time? There must have been a lot of anxiety? No. No? I don't know. I didn't feel that. No? No. What were you feeling? What were you thinking or what were you anticipating in the UK? I didn't anticipate anything. That's why probably I settled in very nicely. Yeah. I didn't have any difficulty. Yeah. I know some people had difficulty in houses and things like that. I didn't have any difficulty; I had a very nice three-bed room house there. Yeah, so you were comfortable? Comfortable. So when you first arrived at the Heathrow Airport, did you come to Heathrow? Yes. Yeah, and when you walked out, what were your first, you know, thoughts, when you saw London and, you know, the weather and all these kinds of things. What were you thinking? Weather was, that day, I still remember when the pilot was saying, those days it was called overcast. It was 8 degrees centigrade. March, March the 8th of March 1968 and the weather was overcast but I came in about half past 4, fourish, so it was already dark. Oh! And lights everywhere. And were you apprehensive about that when you saw it? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, very funny. They had joked, you know, friends joked that I have seen only him for three days. Yeah. And don't go and just hug somebody else and go. Get the wrong person. Wrong person. But it was okay? It was all okay. That's good. One second, hang on a second, I want to just ask. Okay, so, what was it like, because you were, you were settled in this kind of little village area, you know, outside of London. How was the feel then, because there was no There was no other There was no Hindu Community or Indian Community No, there was no body there, just next-door two neighbors that's all I knew and opposite side neighbors, that's all. So did you I just said, "hello" and think the milkman actually was very friendly. He used to talk, if we see each other, he used to talk and say about the country and everything. And tell you, and tell you stuff. After, how, how did you go about, you know, getting your cooking spices or your vegetables or pulse or you know? Yeah. How did you manage? My, my husband was very organized. Okay. There was one small room, a box room or something, and I saw everything be it rice, chapatti or those spices, vegetables just laid on. Everything down there and all the other cooking things and it was a hospital thing, so I didn't utensils and everything, crockery's and everything was there--. And what did you do, may be just, just socialize or was there any other doctors? Were there Indian doctors? Well, yes we used to go for, we used to go to London, we used to go to Leicester Square and all the theatres and there that some, whenever he was free. Okay, very busy are they? Yeah. And used to see other, his friends they were all bachelors then, so they used to live in London so, whenever we used to go there and meet them and that's all and sometimes they used to come to our house and they stayed the night, weekend and they went away on Sunday. Okay. And what about, for like things like, you know temples or anything, was there any temple there? No, there was no temple, no gathering like, no. Only, only I went to a program, that year I think Miss World was Rita Faria. Was what? Rita Faria. Okay She was the Miss World. First Indian Miss World. Really, Okay. I went to that program and that's it. And that was it? Social program. Okay. So, in what year did you move up, this way up to Up to Edinborough? Glasgow, Scotland? Yeah. '70, '69 my eldest daughter was born and '78 the younger one. '71 we came in '71 I think in Edinborough. We lived there about two and a half years then came to Glasgow. You have been here ever since? Since yes. Okay. So when you came to Glasgow, was the community, in Glasgow then? Yes. I come from Bengal so we joined the Bengali culture association and there we met first time, so you know socially. First time in a social group, yeah. Other from London. Yeah. In London we used to go there. But still no temple. Still no temple, so what did you do then for religious festivals or occasions? I had three little children, I was busy you know. You were busy. There was no time for any other things. Okay. So can you tell me how, you know how is the whole community evolved then in Glasgow, when you were a part of the Bengal community? Yes, I am the part of the community now I am a regular Sunday worshipper here. Okay. Regularly, now. When my husband was here, I don't think so, children were growing, I was busy then my husband died and I started working and somehow when I stopped working, I have started coming. Whenever you have time. Where did you work, when you were working? I was working in Soft side at Glasgow as a Project Leader and I started a project for, and all this new project started for elderly people. And over the years that you have been in the U.K., have you or your family ever experienced any racism or you know, prejudice in any way? Not me directly, but once my husband, he was just over the, we were living in Kysely at that time, we just came new here, my husband was getting something, petrol in a petrol station and you know as he was paying with the card and something, so it took some time, there was this man came, "You Indians or you Pakistani's" and the shouting screaming, that taking so long time, my husband was just like that, he didn't say anything, but anyway that was that one. The one occasion. Yeah. Yeah. And sometimes in the surgery, if the patient didn't get what she actually wanted or something, they used to bang the door on his face, something like that. Otherwise not. Nothing. Not, not too bad. And I suppose, we want to ask you about, about your religious practices, have they changed over the years. Did you come from a religious family yourself? I wouldn't say very religious, you know but Hinduism is that you can practice, you don't have to go to a one temple or anything but you can practice it at home. But I couldn't do very much then, but now I have something, at home as well. Okay Everyday I pray there every morning after I have had a shower and thing. You do? Yeah. And what are the, are there any rituals that your family have followed, that you have carried on yourself, you know may be worshipping a particular Murti or you know family tradition with regards to worship. No, not particular, particularly no. Just, not very particular, family Murti or anything. No. No. Okay. And what about family Guru and anything? My husband had a Guru. He had a Guru? And did you follow him as well or, is that how it works or it's individual? It is actually individual. My husband used to pray, you know. He used to pray, he had books to read and from Guru's Bani or something, he used to that every morning, but I never did. You didn't. This is quite, it's quite a broad question, but answer however you feel. What actually makes you, yourself a Hindu, what do you believe makes you a Hindu? I was born into a Hindu family, that's all. That's And that's how we have, as I come from Bengal, we have Durga Puja and all this different Kali Puja, Saraswati Puja and we just form that. And just to cover up the general things now, do you feel that the youths of today, do you feel that they are more or less religious then say when you were youth? We guess that my children are not very religious, they don't want to come to the temple at all. I think it has to be from the beginning, if you start from the young age then, we didn't do anything when they were young, if I say "come on", then they would say "No, Mom, you never taught us anything, I don't know what to do there". They don't want to come. Do you think it's important for the youth to learn their Mother Tongue? I think it is good, it helps. Okay. There is a problem, my children, they don't speak but they do understand. Yeah But they didn't speak. And is, a question I would like to ask to everybody, just to get their opinion on how they feel things are about the Caste system, do you think that its still relevant today, or the people are, you know still holding on to it? Some people do but it is little bit this side, that side you know not so rigidly from I don't think so. Not in our family. Okay not in your particular family? Aha. Okay. A couple of final questions now. How would you actually identify yourself now if somebody just asks you, you know who are you? Because you were born in Bengal, you grew up in Delhi, lived in the UK for several years, you are a Hindu. How would you sum it up if somebody would say who are you? I say I am Indian living in here. I have lived most, more time here than I stayed in India so I am part of this country as well. I think so. And where do you see as home? Home is here. Home is here. Okay. You don't say back home in India? No-no. I say India that's mine. I never say I am going home India. My home is here. Okay. And one final thing, I just to round up the interview. Do you have any final message to give it to people who would be listening to this in the future? You should believe in something. There is a God. But whatever way you think. It helps. There is a one. I am not saying that I am a, I am a believer. I do believe there is a God. There is one almighty God that I believe in that's all. And people should believe if they want to but you cannot force them. Okay. Thank you very much. Thank you.